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A Villanelle (final version)

For Paradise is made of brutal stuff.
But fools strive for the hopelessly mundane,
while Hell shall offer good men quite enough.

One’s honor is a cold, contentious bluff.
Thence, why inquire at Valhalla’s pain,
for Paradise is made of brutal stuff.

No one of us, the frail or ersatz tough
can live a life of truth and Heaven gain
while Hell shall offer good men quite enough.

A man of high regard avows with fluff,
his lies contrived to purify God’s stain,
for Paradise is made of brutal stuff.

The duel is too sublime, the path too rough.
Accomplishment is meaningless and vain
while Hell shall offer good men quite enough.

So why should I not all my virtue slough?
Why ever from my sins should I abstain?
For Paradise is made of brutal stuff
while Hell shall offer good men quite enough.

Style / type: 
Structured: Western
Review Request (Intensity): 
I want the raw truth, feel free to knock me on my back
Review Request (Direction): 
What did you think of my title?
How was my language use?
What did you think of the rhythm or pattern or pacing?
How does this theme appeal to you?
How was the beginning/ending of the poem?
Is the internal logic consistent?
Editing stage: 

Comments

Perhaps "Heaven and Hell" will be a better title.
I don't understand this verse 'his lies contrived to purify God’s stain,"
What do you mean by "God's stain"?
I find this verse contradictory - "while Hell shall offer good men quite enough"
if what you are meaning is that the path to Hell is full of the things that the heart desires, it is still the journey not the hell itself.
As this piece is about paradise and hell, those who don't believe in ny religion might not be able to relate to the theme.

Alid

Alid
.

I need you to submit your poem. Then we will all be assigned a poem to critique. I need your poem.

W. H. Snow

A poet is a nightingale, who sits in darkness and sings to cheer its own solitude with sweet sounds. Percy Bysshe Shelley

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author comment

you did well here... you offered a suggestion for a title, and outlined what you didn't understand.... but I think you could've given more input....

For example, did you look up what a villanelle is,? You haven't commented at all on the form.... if you had, you might have been able to tell Wes that there is a problem with the foot count (iambic pentameter) in verse 5, and also a problem with the iambic in the first verse of the last stanza

As for your interpretation.... I read this as saying the path to heaven is too difficult, and perhaps, once there, a position too much to maintain, whereas hell is more suited to mankind's needs , and probably not so bad..... therefore why be good and moral? Religious and non-religious would find something worthwhile to comment about within this I think

Great write Wes
love judy
xxx

'Each for the joy of the working, and each, in his separate star,
shall draw the Thing as he sees It, for the God of Things as They are.'
(Rudyard Kipling)

I did point out to Wes that I did not know the form and though I did googled it, I still fail to grasp it Wes asked me to critique it as someone who don't know the form at all so I did what I could but reading your feedbacks I think I could have done better.

Alid.

I think you did well in most of the part.
However, I thought you needed to say something about the form and the language use. If you have attempted any of these forms, you'd have commented more on the form and how much was sir Wesley successful in choosing his rhymes, the repeated verse, and the lanģuage used.
I like how you pointed out the verses that didn't make much sense to you in order to help the reader on a later level to give suggestions. I think it is never easy, if not impossible to give alternatives if we don't get the author's intent.

❤❤❤❤❤❤

Poetry is when an emotion has found its thought and the thought has found words
........Robert Frost☺

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I commend you Alid for not shying from saying you flat didn't understand. The language in this poem has always bothered me. I know what I'm saying, but I'm not getting it across.
A very viable critique. You could have offered more suggestions, but I agree with Rula that this is hard.
Thank you Judyanne. That's bad to miss. I'm getting slow.

W. H. Snow

A poet is a nightingale, who sits in darkness and sings to cheer its own solitude with sweet sounds. Percy Bysshe Shelley

Learn how, teach others.
The NeoPoet Mentor Program
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author comment

Technically, this is a well constructed poem with a lot of good wordplay and flow.
That’s what makes the twisted lines stand out so much. Contrived grammar to fit meter or rhyme detracts from the work and weakens the message.
Choosing a structure for a poem means compromises in language but those compromises need not reduce the quality of the poem. In a structured environment, the poem becomes a 3-D puzzle and you must find the right tone, length, flow, and characteristics of lines and words so that every step is an addition to the puzzle rather than a hacked shortcut.
I’ve taken a stab at the first three stanzas and addressed specific areas. My suggestions are [BRACKETED].

For Paradise is made of brutal stuff.
But fools strive [for the hopelessly mundane] - [I really stumbled on the original line]
while Hell shall offer good men quite enough.

One’s honor is a cold, contentious bluff.
Thence, why inquire [at] Valhalla’s pain, - [this is a flow issue. “of” shares a letter sound with “V” and that combination creates a stumble for me on reading the piece aloud.]
for Paradise is made of brutal stuff.

No one of us, the frail or ersatz tough
can live a life of truth [and] Heaven gain - [this is another letter sound flow issue. The soft ending of “of” and the soft beginning of “heaven” do not compliment each other in my mind.]
while Hell shall offer good men quite enough.

Generally, though, I found the piece very well constructed. That’s why the lines in questions galled me so.

Your decision will be to decide if you feel the flow and pacing can carry the awkward lines.

---------------------------------------------------------

Jonathan Moore

It is a poem that has long annoyed me. The form is cool enough (it was during a phase where I was experimenting). But I couldn't clean it up. Your suggestions go a long way.
The funny thing is- my whole family thinks it's the best thing I've written.
Go figure.
Thanks Jonathan.

W. H. Snow

A poet is a nightingale, who sits in darkness and sings to cheer its own solitude with sweet sounds. Percy Bysshe Shelley

Learn how, teach others.
The NeoPoet Mentor Program
http://www.neopoet.com/mentor/about

author comment

I understand the frustration.

---------------------------------------------------------

Jonathan Moore

The poem still bugs me, but it is improved.
Thank you again for taking the time.

W. H. Snow

A poet is a nightingale, who sits in darkness and sings to cheer its own solitude with sweet sounds. Percy Bysshe Shelley

Learn how, teach others.
The NeoPoet Mentor Program
http://www.neopoet.com/mentor/about

author comment

Here is a great example of A Villanelle.
"Do not go gentle into that good night"
by Dylan Thomas

Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

Though wise men at their end know dark is right,
Because their words had forked no lightning they
Do not go gentle into that good night.

Good men, the last wave by, crying how bright
Their frail deeds might have danced in a green bay,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

Wild men who caught and sang the sun in flight,
And learn, too late, they grieved it on its way,
Do not go gentle into that good night.

Grave men, near death, who see with blinding sight
Blind eyes could blaze like meteors and be gay,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

And you, my father, there on the sad height,
Curse, bless, me now with your fierce tears, I pray.
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

You will be familiar with this poem so you should have no troubles in seeing if yours conforms to type.
If a problem just Google Villanelle there are many good explanations as to the layout.
our syllable count is near perfect mostly all 10 out of 10, just the odd line:-
Thence, why inquire of Valhalla’s pain" is different but a great write..
Yours Ian

.
Give critique to help keep Neopoet great.
Unconditional love to you all.
"Learn to love yourself first"
Yours as always, Ian.T, Sparrow, and Yenti

then you forgot to put critique shop in title which lead me to overlook it for days thinking it was just another poem.
OK I looked up this complex form and it appears that you've followed the way it is supposed to be written. This sounds almost as if it belongs in Milton's Paradise Lost. Now Jonathan and others have already done well in initial critique as well as critique of critique. Which Leave me with but 2 suggestions both dealing with stanza 3 "
Line 1 try changing ersatz to feigning (a bit of alliteration)
Line 2.... this seems to imply that heaven has no room for those who tell the truth. If that's what you mean to convey that's fine. If not you might want to rephrase.........stan

Heaven is not a simpering place. It is a place of honor and warriors (of the mind as well as body). It is a dangerous place.
Hell, however, is pretty easy... okay, simple. The towns are tough and honorless, so do whatever you can get away with. That's usually enough for even good men.

W. H. Snow

A poet is a nightingale, who sits in darkness and sings to cheer its own solitude with sweet sounds. Percy Bysshe Shelley

Learn how, teach others.
The NeoPoet Mentor Program
http://www.neopoet.com/mentor/about

author comment

that it's usually not best to meet an angel..............stan

Cupid a bow and arrow of renown and Gabriel bears the Word.
And that's only a start.
Malachi, Doris, Beelzebub and more (As Lucifer, Beelzebub was invited on occasion to return to Heaven where he still voiced his opposition).

W. H. Snow

A poet is a nightingale, who sits in darkness and sings to cheer its own solitude with sweet sounds. Percy Bysshe Shelley

Learn how, teach others.
The NeoPoet Mentor Program
http://www.neopoet.com/mentor/about

author comment

You have just brought a memory back something about corn and children running around and a voice saying " Malachi needs you! Now" lol,
Would have been more fun had it been Doris..

Yours Ian.

PS:- the children just laugh to read your thoughts when writing this, one day or night as you cross over that threshold there will be a peace and understanding, that all things are the same energy and there you will judge yourself and be among like souls until you move on through betterment to attain perfection..

.
Give critique to help keep Neopoet great.
Unconditional love to you all.
"Learn to love yourself first"
Yours as always, Ian.T, Sparrow, and Yenti

You performed an exercise.
I am disappointed.

cheers,
Jess
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