About workshops

Workshops on Neopoet are groups that meet for a certain period of time to focus on a certain aspect of poetry. Each workshop participant is asked to critique all the other poems submitted into a workshop. A workshop leader helps coordinate -- they set the agenda, give participants feedback on whether their submissions and critique are at they level expected of them, and after the workshop is over, give feedback to participants. 

To join a workshop, first find one that is of interest to you. Once you have found the right workshop (and verified that it is open -- you can find this out in the description below), you can apply to join the workshop.


Join the Neopoet online poetry workshop and community to improve as a writer, meet fellow poets, and showcase your work. Sign up, submit your poetry, and get started.

Primal Poetry

Status: 
Program description/goal: 

Making the History of Poetry (part 1) Primal Poetry- Exploring and writing poetry in its primal form.

Leader: weirdelf
Moderator(s): geezer, Paul, Carrie (lonlyhrtsclub13)

Objectives: To attempt to recreate some of the mental conditions under which poetry was invented and write our own modern versions of it.

Level of expertise:  Open to all.

Subject matter: Pre-written word poetry was probably spoken by shamans after drum induced trance.

We will enter a meditative state, which requires no formal training, just sit in a comfy chair, relax, regularise your breathing, close your eyes, whilst listening to shamanic drumming.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmQ1H4wU0zs
It is just 15 minutes with a denouement to lead you home and relaxed.

Then write down what you experienced. When we close our eyes we see colours and forms and allow them to develop while listening to the drumming, which activates visual perception areas of the brain. After the trance we want to be writing fast and free, raw, with little or no editing for the first draft.

We can discuss any questions in the workshop thread
Who wants to come back to the beginning of poetic time with me?

Very Important! Poems are not posted on this page. Post your workshop poem as normal to the Stream except under the Workshop drop-down select 'Open to new participants - Primal Poetry'. Include (Primal Poetry workshop) after the title.
 

Length: 
125 days
Number of participants (limit): 
20 people
Skill level: 
Date: 
Monday, June 17, 2019 to Sunday, October 20, 2019

Comments

i

Can't wait to see what comes out of caveman Stan's head!

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

P

Let's assume a fully developed vocabulary, even though it doesn't make sense it makes less sense to try to express what we experience with uggs, grunts or less words than we know.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

As you know sound is vibration that may have somewhat specific correspondences to states of altered consciousness
The om chant is a classical example of course. Alister Crowley's OTO and the Golden Dawn use sonorous callings used for ritual work ...The callings ( Invocations) to the angels to raise and protect The calling of demons to facilitate comfort in the physical life like gargoyles Feng shui castles Poetry is a ritual of raising power too when spoken with the fullness of intention Thats why the sonic elements of poetry are so important; the language of spirit through the ethers

I'm a bit of a student of Crowley but what is OTO?

ps please use some punctuation and paragraphing, this could end up a long thread and it makes reading so much easier on the eye)

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I'm working on something that is a link to this paradigm.

~ Marthalyn

here we speak only as poets, and perhaps seers, just, only, what we ourselves see.

Hmm, did I jump the gun a bit there?
Yes, it is important to acknowledge that the strangely beautiful words issuing from the mouth of the first poets would have made them objects of power and veneration.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

the most comprehensive study of tribal poetry i know is by Jerome Rothenberg, "Techinicians of the Sacred" I was lucky to have a lecture course with him in the 60's. Poetry from Aborigines, Eskimo, Pigmy, etc. Poetry from the gut in praise of primal needs and paganism. The recordings of the poems are available and the themes are universal. That course influenced me in ways i can no longer count.
I am looking forward to doing your meditation and writing. No mushrooms this time.

Eumolpus
I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing
than teach ten thousand stars how not to dance
ee cummings

Your input is going too be invaluable. It also means you will understand my passion on the subject; it was at the core of my MA thesis.

Yes, I've done it with and without herbal enhancement. [grins]

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I think it was there long before the
ability to speak or punctuate the first
grunted offerings ... it is after-all, the
sounds, sights and emotion that move
us, shared.

As a side note, does anyone know of any other species creating beauty for its own sake, not just to attract the other gender?

On the other hand, poetry has got me laid. Is our art entirely altruistic?

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

H

sex

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

F

.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

It actively stimulates visual areas of the brain, also those associated with the subconscious and memory . We are attempting to induce 'active dreaming'.

It can vary from person to person. The one I have reccomended works for most people and is a convenient length. https://soundcloud.com/neopoet/shamanic-drumming-15min However if you do a search on Youtube under 'shamanic drumming' you will find many others.

I highly recommend routing your computer sound through your home stereo to get maximum bass effect, that bass sound is so important.

You can download the track for listening whilst offline at
https://soundcloud.com/neopoet/shamanic-drumming-15min

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

could be an alternative title for this workshop.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

S

what makes you think there will be anything animalistic about it?
Enhancing our self awareness can surely only make us more human.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

T

.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

s

Definitely up my ally....music provokes very strong emotion and if my memory serves me, as a child, my father and I read aloud the song of Hiawatha in rhythm....it was captivating.

Keep Writing,
Carrie

"Quoth said the Raven, NEVERMORE"

I hope it takes me to a good place.
I need that.
My drums have been sitting idle for quite awhile. After the production I may create a variation.
Later,

~Mark~

Having difficulty navigating Neopoet or having trouble with an understanding regarding Neopoet? Look for the Advocate badge and reach out to an Advocate.

You're tech savvy, you could record your own drumming and use it as a background track for your poetry.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

This sounds interesting

Keep Writing,
Carrie

"Quoth said the Raven, NEVERMORE"

w

So what's the timing?
Does it need be consistent?
The heart can change in how hard it pounds and in speed.
I'm thinking of layering the differences later on in the study.
This is getting better and better :~)
Later,

~Mark~

Having difficulty navigating Neopoet or having trouble with an understanding regarding Neopoet? Look for the Advocate badge and reach out to an Advocate.

E

Maybe I'll look into that as I have plenty of experience but first things first.
I'm betting that back then it was kept very simple.
Think I'll just experience the video first and get the feeling of it, after all music needs to be felt not listened to.

~Mark~

Having difficulty navigating Neopoet or having trouble with an understanding regarding Neopoet? Look for the Advocate badge and reach out to an Advocate.

Brain waves

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

The timing is quite different, about 5 per second, and yes it needs to be consistent.
The effect of the drumming is neurological, it directly influences brain wave frequency.

Again, not to do with the heart.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

Understood soon as I heard it.
Later,

~Mark~

Having difficulty navigating Neopoet or having trouble with an understanding regarding Neopoet? Look for the Advocate badge and reach out to an Advocate.

Did some great spoken word. He used a lot of native american and shamanic inspiration. My massage therapist uses one type that I really like.

Keep Writing,
Carrie

"Quoth said the Raven, NEVERMORE"

Did some great spoken word. He used a lot of native american and shamanic inspiration. My massage therapist uses one type that I really like.

Keep Writing,
Carrie

"Quoth said the Raven, NEVERMORE"

That journey did in fact take me on a journey.
It wasn't until I began to feel a very delicate echo that I really tapped into the feeling of it all.
I have a first attempt, a rough draft.

Where to post? What to say about it?

Later,

~Mark~

Having difficulty navigating Neopoet or having trouble with an understanding regarding Neopoet? Look for the Advocate badge and reach out to an Advocate.

post as with any workshop, put (Primal Poetry) next to the title and most importantly select the Workshop dropdown 'Open to new participants - Primal Poetry' before saving.

Let's save editing till after we have discussed the work.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

check out the guidelines below in my comment below- 'Starting as soon as you like.'

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

While listening to shamanic music...are we trying to achieve this with this poem? I have astral projected..had visions...heard voices...received clear messages....provoked all kinds of strong emotions from euphoria to rage to extreme sadness. Am I on the right path

Keep Writing,
Carrie

"Quoth said the Raven, NEVERMORE"

They have suggested visualising a cave and following it underground to another world and describing what I see and encounter there.

I'm curious what people will see without the influence of a guide.

I'd say you're spot on and well in advance of most of us, Carrie.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

interesting topic...i meditate and write in nature..this sounds interesting...

*Collaborative Poetry Workshop* American Version of Japanese Poetry ~ Renga ~ Haiku, Senyru, Tanka.

Neopoet Community

When does it take place?

Just sit in a comfy chair, relax, regularise your breathing, close your eyes, clear your mind, whilst listening to shamanic drumming.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmQ1H4wU0zs you can download the track at
https://soundcloud.com/neopoet/shamanic-drumming-15min for listening offline.
Best to play it through your home sound system or good headphones to get a full bass sound, that is really important.

Then when you 'come back' immediately write down your experience. It may help to keep the drums playing on repeat.

If this particular track doesn't suit you search YouTube under 'shamanic drumming', there are several others and it does vary slightly from person to person.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

feature etc.
on Soundcloud.
How to download it?

Later,

~Mark~

Having difficulty navigating Neopoet or having trouble with an understanding regarding Neopoet? Look for the Advocate badge and reach out to an Advocate.

working on that

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

Maybe send it email?
Later,

~Mark~

Having difficulty navigating Neopoet or having trouble with an understanding regarding Neopoet? Look for the Advocate badge and reach out to an Advocate.

please check YouTube and SoundCloud options for a repeat function.
I downloaded it from YouTube, converted to MP3 then uploaded to SoundCloud. To download from YouTube you need an extension for your browser like 'Keepvid' or 'VideoDowloadHelper'.
I made the file 'downloadable' on SoundCloud so there must be a way to do it. Let us all know if you figure it out,
ta

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

When we close our eyes we see colours and forms. Here we will allow them to develop while listening to the drumming, which activates visual perception areas of the brain.

After the trance we want to be writing fast and free, raw, with little or no editing for the first draft.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

On my first attempt I was taken to memories and then landed on one and could feel it but not as a reality. More of a dream/memory mixed I decided to write it anyhow.
https://www.neopoet.com/workshop/poems/mellifluous-sky-primal-poetry

I fell into a dream later and it was like none before. It had very interesting characteristics. As dreams can be it was recalled a bit fragmented. But the idea of primal scene was certainly there.

Can we post more than one?

Later,

~Mark~

Having difficulty navigating Neopoet or having trouble with an understanding regarding Neopoet? Look for the Advocate badge and reach out to an Advocate.

That was absolutely amazing. I am working on composing my experiences. And absolutely subconscious provoking piece of music...incredible

Keep Writing,
Carrie

"Quoth said the Raven, NEVERMORE"

I

But you have to really tune into the drum beat. Feel it in every part of your body...let your mind succumb to it...it may shock you what it provokes. The sounds of nature can do the same thing and more than likely have a different effect.

Keep Writing,
Carrie

"Quoth said the Raven, NEVERMORE"

Focused away from memories.
Much more satisfying.
Fell below the beat several times.
Deep relaxation.
Wish I could put it on repeat.
Could see fragments of Watermana and think I could understand that experience.
Wrote this session as well... hmm that's three.
Love this workshop.
Later,

~Mark~

Having difficulty navigating Neopoet or having trouble with an understanding regarding Neopoet? Look for the Advocate badge and reach out to an Advocate.

i sat outside in nature today and listen...i got no visuals....i usually don't...i've learned to meditate and visual without a a guide after meditating with guide that help you do it yourself

*Collaborative Poetry Workshop* American Version of Japanese Poetry ~ Renga ~ Haiku, Senyru, Tanka.

Neopoet Community

look at the insides of your eyelids. You will see something. Colors or lights but sooner or later bwam something really cool. the idea seems to be focusing away from memories if that happens.
Keep it going..
Later,

~Mark~

Having difficulty navigating Neopoet or having trouble with an understanding regarding Neopoet? Look for the Advocate badge and reach out to an Advocate.

After listening I could see myself in a swing set as a child enjoying myself. After a couple minutes I was startled by fear then a sense of calmness. Great concept great shop jess

helping each other.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

enjoyed the 15 minute drumming by Michael Harner, there is also a 30 minute drumming solo from him on YouTube as well :)

Keep Writing,
Carrie

"Quoth said the Raven, NEVERMORE"

My favourite, which I used on "Watermana" is an 8 drummer 30 minute special for advanced divers into the nether realms only!

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I want to try it

Keep Writing,
Carrie

"Quoth said the Raven, NEVERMORE"

and I can't find it anywhere. I originally got it off a cassette tape, pre-CD!
There are many, many different shamanic drumming tracks to be found on YouTube and SoundCloud, up to 6 hours long!

I encourage everyone to experiment to find the right fit. For example I once found a multiple drumming track that I liked the sound of but meditating to it caused extreme discomfort. On an instinct I tried speeding it up and slowing it down ever so slightly and changing it from 5 beats per second to 4.95 beats per second transformed it into a powerful tool.

Deep waters here, it depends on how much you are prepared to experiment. 'Audacity' is a very powerful and intuitive free software for manipulating sounds. My voice normally sounds like a heavy smoking Donald Duck but a few tweaks in Audacity and I sound like Sean Connery (without the accent) [grins]

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

T

You'll get it.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I'd like to be included. This is unlike anything I've ever done. Drumbeat was fascinating. My rough draft is really weird. But it was fun.

and most welcome. Please remember if you produce any work from the experience to post it as normal to the Stream except under the Workshop drop-down select 'Open to new participants - Primal Poetry' before saving. Include (Primal Poetry workshop) after the title.

Have a nice (drug free) trip.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I had been a practising shaman for many years when I wrote "Watermana"
https://www.neopoet.com/node/2465

Unlike most times I did 'the journey' I went into that one knowing exactly what I wanted. To bring back mana, Chi, empowerment of feeling for so many I knew who were stifled or confused in their emotions as so many of us are in modern society.

It succeed so wildly, I felt the spray of water its depths, its wildness, its beauty so profoundly I wrote that poem immediately, barely a word of revision. And because it was so visual and you can not take a video camera into your head I taught myself 3D computer animation and made the accompanying video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35PQwrUZdPw

The two combined with a short written thesis got me awarded a Masters Degree in Poetry with one of the examiners commenting "This work is of significance to world art theory and practice".

I hope this workshop helps you with your poetry, knowing where it comes from, the importance of meter. At least you will certainly get to know yourself a bit better.

And rhyme is a later addition, when it comes to prosodic form meter comes first, then alliteration, assonance and consonance, rhyme coming an easiest-to-do lame last.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I am interested in the challenge

I am not seeing the workshop in the drop-down. Is it a matter of permissions and I just need to be patient?

---------------------------------------------------------

Jonathan Moore

Try again now.
Welcome, Jonathon. I suspect that you, being a very rational and measured person, might have a little trouble getting this but just listen to the drums, watch the eyelid movies without trying to control them and let go.
Have a nice trip.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

Ok! Submissions are coming in. Remember, write raw and quick. We are not looking for sonnets here, we are looking for lucid honesty.

All submissions, look to the top right of this page under-
MOST RECENT POEMS
>> View all poems submitted to this workshop
https://www.neopoet.com/workshop/view/25824

So far we have-
https://www.neopoet.com/workshop/poems/flowing-silk-primal-poetry-second...
https://www.neopoet.com/workshop/poems/where-phantoms-flitprimal-poetry-...
https://www.neopoet.com/workshop/poems/primal-scream
https://www.neopoet.com/workshop/poems/mellifluous-sky-primal-poetry

How is this working for everyone else? The only poetic consideration when writing down your experience is the meter, the rhythm, the beat da dum da dum, the beat da dum da dum, the beat da dum da dum....

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

Few people enter the deep waters of the subconscious as we are doing without a mentor/guru/guide/shrink. With shamanic work this would be a bit like one of those guided meditations that start with you imagining a comfy orange glow or something. With shamanistic journeying the entrance is usually a cave leading to a nether world or a world tree like the Norse 'Yggdrasil' that you climb.

We, like all poets, are going in guideless and though it may get scary there is no chance of permanent harm, ok?

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

should do it yourself. If you're too scared or timid to do it without some other person present, you'll never be able to really take a bare look.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I'll do a new one soon too

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

Lots to learn from ourselves and a creative workshop like this. I've got some wireless headphones I'm charging up rigjht now and will use on my journey into the abyss

Lightweight and very comfortable. They rock.
I fear that if I use wired then the pressure from them would be distracting.
Later,

~Mark~

Having difficulty navigating Neopoet or having trouble with an understanding regarding Neopoet? Look for the Advocate badge and reach out to an Advocate.

remember to click the Workshop drop-down and select 'Open to new participants - Primal Poetry' before saving a poem.

Try to read the workshop description and this thread from my comment 'Starting as soon as you like.' onwards.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I'm in if there is still room.

T

The most powerful reaction
of mind on mind
is transference of sight

remember to click the Workshop drop-down and select 'Open to new participants - Primal Poetry' before saving a poem.

Try to read the workshop description and this thread from my comment 'Starting as soon as you like.' onwards.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

can I still enter?

but yes, remember to click the Workshop drop-down and select 'Open to new participants - Primal Poetry' before saving a poem.

Try to read the workshop description and this thread from my comment 'Starting as soon as you like.' onwards.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I'll enter the next one, thanks!

Stage 1 we were attempting 'surrender'. The results of watching 'eyelid movies' without conscious interference should have been often seemingly random imagery. Conscious dreaming. Therein lies the difficulty for many people. Letting go. Too cerebral has been my major criticism of some of the works so far. It's all about the imagery. Interpretation comes later.That's why shamans have notoriously used hallucinogenic drugs as an aid but I don't recommend it, it's not necessary and can be very dangerous.

Stage 2 we will introduce some simple direction but again letting go as far as possible, letting our subconscious throw up imagery. My statement guide for Watermana, as I describe above in my comment "Ok, my experience" was 'seek mana of water'.
You can use simple statements or questions like-
Know myself.
Know others better.
Heal myself.
Heal others.
What I need.
Communicate better with others.
What others need of me.
World peace.
[smiles]
Just keep it simple, state it once to yourself, start the drumming and let your subconscious do the work.
Here are some more poetry based directions-
Home
Where I need to be
Her/Him
The future
Now
Passion
Memory
Any topic you have in mind for a poem just keep it simple, let the imagery flow free, unpreconceived.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

And into this shamanic cave? I'll have a go too. I think we need more of this.

Cheers.

Chris.

Chris Hall - Tasmania

Grossbooted draymen rolled barrels dullthudding out of Prince's stores and bumped them up on the brewery float. On the brewery float bumped dullthudding barrels rolled by grossbooted draymen out of Prince's stores.

Read the workshop description and this thread from my comment 'Starting as soon as you like' onwards, carefully.
https://www.neopoet.com/comment/166794#comment-166794

Remember to click the Workshop drop-down and select 'Open to new participants - Primal Poetry' before saving a poem.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I listened for a while before starting to write, so I saw an eyelid movie before I ever started! Maybe that is why it had the effect that it did I have Native American heritage, so I naturally gravitated to that sort of scene. I am most anxious to start the next phase and will try to write more spontaneously this time. I do think it came out well, but not as I hoped. ~ Gee.
.

Please acknowledge critique and comments.
They are a vital part of our community!
Critique or comment today!

My session was interrupted yesterday so I will start again this evening

Keep Writing,
Carrie

"Quoth said the Raven, NEVERMORE"

ive been practicing guided self meditation since 2017 to manage MS so once i got this..it was right up my ally tapping into ability to write whats on my eyelid my inner voice...

*Collaborative Poetry Workshop* American Version of Japanese Poetry ~ Renga ~ Haiku, Senyru, Tanka.

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1

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cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
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Robin Skelton is a name that just came to mind.

I've not yet read any of her work but will definitely check it out,
thanks again,

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

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I had to look him up, but i like what I found. Check out "Westfield Lane" - I find parallels between him and Ted Hughes, whose poetry I always considered primal.

Ref: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robin_Skelton
https://pennyspoetry.fandom.com/wiki/Robin_Skelton

Cheers,

Chris

Chris Hall - Tasmania

Grossbooted draymen rolled barrels dullthudding out of Prince's stores and bumped them up on the brewery float. On the brewery float bumped dullthudding barrels rolled by grossbooted draymen out of Prince's stores.

How do you feel about this whole shamanic trance thing in relation to your poetry now?

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

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Shamanic trance. I get a lot out of it. Working on part 2

Keep Writing,
Carrie

"Quoth said the Raven, NEVERMORE"

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

Having received, by now, enough messages to kill a horse, I wanted to just make a public statement here on what goes on/went on/with Jess and the people who message me about him.

While one never has to choose to be on a website or to do this or that, I am particularly happy that I chose to be on Neopoet, despite the petty chain mail going around now. Jess has moods like all of us do, but of course I won't sponsor any abusive comments towards anyone of any gender. That's my "stance" on it. If this site is "male dominated" as I've also heard from women here, let's go ahead and bring more women in. I will help with this myself. But this sneakiness, this pettiness...

This is a microcosm of a bigger picture. While there's infighting here because of a problem--and infighting amongst such intelligent people--angling for power with the varied forms of identity politics
does nothing but weaken "tolerant, liberal" people. The really intolerant and inauthentic people (maybe the people who voted for Donald Trump) take this as a game to watch from afar and occasionally take advantage (pretending to agree, pretending to be "part of the dialogue") and the rest of the nonsense.

It does not matter what rings you wear in your nose, or how stylish and well adapted to the times your politics are; that is a matter of adaptation to everyday life which requires no sacrifice; the people who would see no use in poetry are winning (and have been) and in very big numbers because of this incestuous, disgusting infighting.

There are no safe spaces. Boundaries are routinely violated just because of the nature of daily life, though of course these are noble aspirations. The underlying spirit of poetry is a spirit of *revolt*, not acquiescence to the way things are, even with the growth of MFA programs and assorted fetid vegetation. (That's a topic on its own: the last thing I wanted to do when I left school was to go back to school to be sold fucking textbooks on how to write according to *this* expert on blackness, whiteness, whatever; that's them getting into your head, not you thinking your own thoughts and developing naturally.)

It would seem, though, that we love our power schemes and little beautifully melodramatic arguments which we *have* to win, incidentally --even on a relatively modest, and tranquil website like Neopoet--more than we like the prospect of victory on a larger scale. And this is exactly the kind of behavior which elects Donald Trump and his abominable oligarchical next cousins again and again; unguarded, naive liberalism. Fascism, the underlying Geist of this present age, is *actually* the polar opposite of poetry; if for some perverse reason identity politique liberals WANT to experience it, it won't be enjoyable or chic when you get there.

Is there any material spirit of insurrection even left, now that we've become so comfortable and homogenized? Anything that transcends the ridiculously overinflated ivy towers so full of masturbatory overanalysis of the slightest infirmity or discomfort. If not, poets like Leonora Carrington, Rimbaud, Lecomte, Emily Dickinson all lived in vain.

I'd like to thank everyone for reading my rant; though I think it has more of a spirit than most rants, though not entirely devoid, maybe, of pathos

Neopoet is like Cape Cod to me.

"We will end roasted by our manmade suns." David Gascoyne. ???

It's not 'a public statement', it's a workshop, not all members. A blog or forum would have been more appropriate.
I'm not being 'boss of you', I'm asking you nicely considering you posted it in the wrong place, and because it is irrelevant to and a distraction from this workshop, to please delete your comment and post it elsewhere, ok?

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I love every word!!!!!!!!

Just a follow up that I allowed myself to fall into dreamland through the drumming and it was the same dreamland as usual, just a lot of unfamiliar weird stuff. I get much more from the relaxation out of the drumming and feel much better when I break out of it than when I am sleeping/dreaming. That good feeling when I am done deeply relaxing is well worth the exercises thus far. Thanks Jess for this workshop.
Later,

~Mark~

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with the messages and that's my response to the whole thing and I find it necessary to put it up where people are going to read it. Call it a favor.

primal poetic statement.

ok

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

Unless I'm tagged in a message like the one that invited me here..when it's going downing in here its going down...definitely wrong place to have this discussion... what about a discussion type feature on the main page similar to a board room to discuss major issue like this...that's overseen by the AEC to get a head of major throw down vicious fights.. I been here since January 2008 and I seen doozies..been in a couple and we always get through it...

*Collaborative Poetry Workshop* American Version of Japanese Poetry ~ Renga ~ Haiku, Senyru, Tanka.

Neopoet Community

This sort of thing is always about someone's assertion of will over another Thinking one has the right to judge another's sensibilities ethics morals spirituality etc and wantonly force that opinion! It is not an expression of sensitivity but balls out frustration and subsequent aggression. Aggression breeds aggression loops or cowering victims. It is not about illumination. In spite of good intentions its impulse is tyranny and fear. It is not about facilitation; actually quite the opposite! The way to conduct workshops in my opinion is to utilize the Socratic method.
I spent years in the cooperate sales culture and learned quite early if you want to fail socially just assert to others how it is. What was axiomatic in that environment was that if you asked the right questions the person you where encountering would sell themselves through the act of their own deduction I think the same is true here and everywhere.

In the context of poetry I will take advice quite readily if it strikes a cord and I have respect for the writer who gives it May be we should consider the meaning of the axiom ….. TO LISTEN IS TO OBEY...and if the feeling of obedience is in the spirit of ones benefit; it works; if not, it makes enemies

So we can constructively critique each other. This is a workshop environment. We can disagree with each other too but always with respect and companionability or all digresses. No one tells anyone anything unless there is reciprocity

Having said that we all struggle with anger and frustration Sometimes it is what is needed to clear the air. The healing may come in apologies and forgiveness; so we can move on.

Best Z

In the context of this workshop I am using Shamanic trance as a tool for poets to access deeper parts of the consciousness, ignoring its mystical values.

If you find that offensive I am sorry but that is what I am doing.

It's about the poetry and I know from experience it is valuable. Can you not allow that this powerful tool can be used for the 'mundane' purpose of poetry?

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I don't find the idea of a shamanic trance offensive in the least. If anything I applaud it!
We've all said our peace now. We are brothers and friends even if we rough house Jess

if you then meditate while listening to the drumming they start to form images. Just describe the images and what you feel, don't worry about making it poetry.

That's all there is to it.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

When you say they form images are you referring to images via the imagination or something else

or whatever. Pictures. I call 'em 'eyelid movies'. Where there come from? I don't know but my bet is the subconscious.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I ask because I have 2 distinct experiences One is simply the images of imagination; the other is actual forms beings human and non humanin 3 dimensions

My suggestion is to write merely descriptive, minimum interpretation, minimum attempt at poetic values.

This would seem to be the best way to access what this process has to reveal.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

By far the best work shop

Keep Writing,
Carrie

"Quoth said the Raven, NEVERMORE"

Your input has been invaluable too.
Please remember to check out other's submissions, you may be able to help them if they are having difficulty 'letting go'.
https://www.neopoet.com/workshop/view/25824

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

What is the likelihood we can keep this going? Maybe put up a new piece to listen to here and there to explore? Different sounds provoke different things in the subconscious. I am really enjoying this whole experience.

Keep Writing,
Carrie

"Quoth said the Raven, NEVERMORE"

I'll try again to find that long multiple drum piece, it is potent stuff.

I'll keep extending the workshop as long as there is interest.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

Until 20th October and can keep on being extended as long as it is active.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

My subconscious Is a dark place....but I enjoy checking in with it

Keep Writing,
Carrie

"Quoth said the Raven, NEVERMORE"

Read the workshop description and this thread from my comment 'Starting as soon as you like' onwards, carefully.
https://www.neopoet.com/comment/166794#comment-166794

Remember to click the Workshop drop-down and select 'Open to new participants - Primal Poetry' before saving a poem.

"Close your eyes,

Do you see black?

No, you do not, you see vague colours and forms. DO NOT TRY! RELAX, SURRENDER AND ALLOW,

This is more difficult for some than others.

If you give yourself a quiet, relaxed place, sit in a comfy chair, breathe in a deep relaxed manner, allow the colours and images that form from your eyelids, they will start to form images and even a narrative. There will be feelings.

Then just tell us what you experienced, verbatim, do not try to make it poetry.
cheers,
Jess"

"Sit back in a quiet place, clear your mind and let it wrap around the beat of the drums. The colors and images will start to form, don't try to stop it, let it go. You will feel things physically and emotionally. Once you are done, write those down as raw as it played out in your mind. Can't wait to see what you come up with.
Keep Writing,
Carrie"

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I have not checked them all and can not vouch for them all but willgive feedback when I ccan. Please everyone who tries any of them let us know what they're like, ok?

Schamanische Heiltrommel, 45 Minuten schamanische Reise nach Michael Harner - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TFodLQjkkvo
Shamanic Journey Solo and Double Drumming by Michael Harner - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0K78eKXsYeg
Traditional Shamanic Drum Journey - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jeSZzaUod-w
POWERFUL SHAMANIC DRUMMING (32 MINS) - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5wve2RSSrA
Wild shamanic DOUBLE DRUMMING JOURNEY (15 min.) - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tTvGl5yQh98
Real Shaman Healing Drum Part 4! 60 min. shamanic journey - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjVyAHFYrUQ
Go into a DEEP TRANCE : Shamanic DRUM JOURNEY (28 min.) - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DgD1oruX6WE
02 20 Minute Double Drumming Track - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KXMF16qQkjk
Shamanic Journey (26th Live Performance) - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2tA2P1OkK0
REAL 6 HOUR SHAMANIC JOURNEY | Chanting Meditation |Drumming For Shamanic Journey - Isochronic Tones - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKPW8acHGQ4
Deep Shamanic Trance ➤ ( INTENSE DRUMMING MUSIC FOR SHAMANIC JOURNEYING ) 8 Hz Frequency Brain Waves - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bXihbvDh0RY
Multiple Drumming - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixvGTp3TZTQ
*Powerful-Must See* Shaman Fire Dance Trance Meditation - American Drum Meditation - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krvtJFuOmRI
20-Minute Shamanic Drumming with Callback - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqIEgoGbVsA
Go into a DEEP TRANCE : Shamanic DRUM JOURNEY (28 min.) - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DgD1oruX6WE&list=PL4FIuWmsoTL55WxbvnUlHA...
Multiple Drumming Journey - YouTube Ashram Jam - Welcoming the Spirits of the Drums - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqMu5c04reE
Multiple Drumming Journey - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VOwMJ0y0aWs

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

To try these

Keep Writing,
Carrie

"Quoth said the Raven, NEVERMORE"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqMu5c04reE

I confess to enhancing it with some pharmaceuticals but it came out verbatim in poetic form, that's the way I think, there was nothing contrived. Have you noticed that my 'everyday' Facebook posts often have strong prosodic values? You can't be a poet for fifty years without thinking and speaking in poetry. I felt the need to say this because I have been emphasising to newcomers to Shamanic journeying that they should just describe the images and feelings without worrying about poetry. I did just that- described my journey, and it came out as poetry.

https://www.neopoet.com/workshop/poems/i%E2%80%99m-love-again-primal-poe...

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

This workshop is exceeding all expectations and we need to read and critique each others work.
https://www.neopoet.com/workshop/view/25824

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

Exceeding all expectations??? Hmmmmmmmmm

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I love it

I have found a one hour multiple drumming with recall. It's 51 mg, I could compress it more but it would reduce sound quality.
You can access it via my OneDrive. If you want it PM me and I'll send you the sign-in and password.

This is the real thing, not for beginners.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I don't know what it would be
we could discuss it and see,
perhaps more specific guides
or questions at deeper levels?
Perhaps reshaping them more for prosodic qualities.

Wojarekon?

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

It seems that I finally found a good mantra and would at least like to continue with phase 2.
It's kind of slow going because in my shape I need to be in the right bodymind place.
I'm not sure what a phase 3 would be but certainly am interested.

~Mark~

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Finally got it. If you want that 1 hour multiple drumming track just send me your address, Private message it to me and a link to it on Google+ will be sent to you. Excellent quality too.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

was my first introduction to the power of drumming in the subconscious, it introduced me to one of my 'spirit guides'
https://www.amazon.com/Healing-Drum-African-Ceremonial-Ritual/dp/0892815...
or if you send it me your email address I can send you a Google+ link to download it.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

no Phase 3 formally, however I will keep the workshop open especially for those who want to experiment with one hour drumming session and 'The Healing Drum' tracks, we would love to hear your experiences. Just PM me your email address and I can send you a link to either.

Feedback to your fellow participants, please, all the submitted poems can be found at
https://www.neopoet.com/workshop/view/25824

And feedback for me, please.
How did you feel about his workshop? Criticisms and suggestions? Requests for future workshops?

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

I'm not looking for praise. How can I get better at running them if you don't tell me what you want?
Please, any critique of this workshop or any suggestions for workshops in general or specifically.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

Synopsis:

Excellent concept and execution. Participants were engaged throughout. Actual, useful critique of effort. Good use of multiple stages.

Suggested Modifications:

Concrete timelines for each stage to give some participants (me) a deadline against to work.

Definitive start and end time for each phase to better coordinate with additional workshops.

Personal participation:

This was a tough one for me. It was most assuredly outside my comfort zone. The critique of my effort was accurate and appreciated. Ultimately, I participated in only the initial phase, letting other obligations and pressures take precedence.

Conclusion:

Worth putting in the workshop toolkit to be rerun periodically.

---------------------------------------------------------

Jonathan Moore

noted, especially with regards to timeframes and deadlines. It's true, nothing better than a deadline for a kick up the butt.
Jonathon.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment

Your workshop was well executed and put me back in touch with an important tool for poetry and life.
Thank you,

~Mark~

Having difficulty navigating Neopoet or having trouble with an understanding regarding Neopoet? Look for the Advocate badge and reach out to an Advocate.

Mark.

cheers,
Jess
Neopoet is a workshop. Poets take the time to read and think about your work and offer suggestions.
There is no obligation to make any changes however please acknowledge critique and comments.

author comment
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